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Post by dkehler on Jan 8, 2012 19:11:30 GMT -6
Somebody put it this way at HF. In general, it's easier to be better than three teams than it is to be better than four teams.
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Post by The Unknown Poster on Jan 9, 2012 10:28:11 GMT -6
I understand what you're saying but I dont think its nearly as big a deal as some say the PA thinks it is . It becomes an issue if the 5th place team in the 8 team conference has more points than the 4th place team in the 7 team conference but doesnt make the playoffs. But the amount of points needed to qualify in your conference is the same whether there are 7 teams or 8 teams.
Why not call them divisions for the sake of scheduling and just have the top 8 teams per east/west conference qualify, then it doesnt matter how many teams are in each division. I think the NHL wants something that is good for scheduling whereas the PA is looking at that and saying "wait a minute, thats not good for competition".
I think the NHL and PA are focused on two completely different things.
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Post by djk on Jan 9, 2012 10:45:55 GMT -6
The number of teams is less important than the strength of the teams in the division. If the division with 8 teams had 3 really weak teams in it, the other 5 might have an advantage of a 7 team division with all comparatively strong teams. It's all relative.
I'm not really bothered about staying in the east one more year. I don't think travel has been that bad, and it might get planned out much better next year for road trips.
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Post by floatyghosthat on Jan 9, 2012 11:06:21 GMT -6
Keep in mind that with the new alignment, a full half of your games are against conference rivals. This means that you'll have 8 teams fighting for the same pile of points. The competition will be much more direct than it is now.
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Post by USApegger on Jan 9, 2012 11:58:22 GMT -6
Keep in mind that with the new alignment, a full half of your games are against conference rivals. This means that you'll have 8 teams fighting for the same pile of points. The competition will be much more direct than it is now. Exactly, that's why you can't compare where the Jets are right now in points, and then use that point total to say they would be second last in the new division. (thats what you did Lawless)
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kj79
2nd Line Winger
Posts: 329
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Post by kj79 on Jan 9, 2012 12:21:47 GMT -6
Keep in mind that with the new alignment, a full half of your games are against conference rivals. This means that you'll have 8 teams fighting for the same pile of points. The competition will be much more direct than it is now. Exactly, that's why you can't compare where the Jets are right now in points, and then use that point total to say they would be second last in the new division. (thats what you did Lawless) The only thing that is relative is our play against those teams, sadly 0-3.
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Post by Grumpz on Jan 9, 2012 15:58:43 GMT -6
The number of teams is less important than the strength of the teams in the division. If the division with 8 teams had 3 really weak teams in it, the other 5 might have an advantage of a 7 team division with all comparatively strong teams. It's all relative. I'm not really bothered about staying in the east one more year. I don't think travel has been that bad, and it might get planned out much better next year for road trips. Actually it's not relative. If you are in a division of 8, your chances will always be less, to make the playoffs. Unless they realign, you as a player or as an owner will only have a 50% chance of making the playoffs, vs. 57% in a 7 team conference. It will never equal out due to the law of averages. You're always going to be competing with more teams for the same number of spots. If I was a player/owner, I wouldn't vote yes for this, unless of course I was in the division of 7!
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Post by djk on Jan 9, 2012 16:07:19 GMT -6
Yes yes, I can do the math just like everyone else. I'm only pointing out that the teams aren't all equal in terms of skill or financial clout. I mean if you are in a division with Columbus do you really have to beat out 4 teams or 3 teams + Columbus?
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Post by swervinmervin on Jan 9, 2012 16:20:25 GMT -6
The other thing to keep in mind is that, regardless of how crazy it might seem to some, there is talk of the NHL expanding. The expansion would likely be 2 franchises, which brings each of the putative 4 conferences to.....8 teams. That may be the other reason why the NHL isn't blowing any gaskets about having to wait for the realignment. Once they get to 32 teams, the second issue evaporates. Now, if I felt like being a "rat" - and starting this whole debate going for another 8 pages - I could say that it shouldn't really matter either way..............
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Post by Dcmac on Jan 9, 2012 19:19:04 GMT -6
Just listened to Chipman's thoughts on the cancellation. Does anyone else feel giddy when he speaks still? I still can't believe he's gone from the owner of the Moose to an NHL owner.
This cancellation sucks, but I didn't like our conference much anyhow. Hopefully they can iron out the issues without a labour dispute..
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Post by JETStender on Jan 9, 2012 22:07:19 GMT -6
All they have to do is offer a cross over to the 5th place team in a 8 team conference to play in a 7 team conference.
i.e. 5th in conference 1 has more points than 4th in conference 3.
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Post by jjmoohead on Jan 10, 2012 7:58:27 GMT -6
Why not have the top 3 in each conference make the playoffs and do the final 2 spots as wildcards much like baseball. This way the top 6 in the West (3+3) are in and the other 9 teams would fight over the the other 2.
Now they can't complain about 5th in the 8 team division not getting in if they are above the 7th place team.
They would have to make the schedule closer to what it is today with all west teams playing each other equally or you run into the same problems as now only this time teams would complain they have to play detriot 6 times and another west team might only see them twice.
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jmt21
1st Line Centre
"Winnipeg... Hello"
Posts: 480
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Post by jmt21 on Jan 10, 2012 9:00:52 GMT -6
OK. Crucify me..... laugh.. jeer or whatever. Here would be my plan for a radical realignment (amazing what goes thru one's head when fighting insomnia..LOL)
Screw the divisions - Screw the conferences. Have one league wide conference/division with all 30 teams. Start with a home and home against the other 29 teams.
1) This covers 70% of the schedule or 58 games 2) All teams have equal travel costs for first 58 games 3) Every city is guaranteed to see every team at least once.
For the remaining 24 games the opponents should be determined by the previous years final standings.
1) If Columbus finished 30th.... they would play those 24 games in a home & home against the teams ranked 18th - 29th.
2) The team finishing in 15th would play the 6 teams immediately above them and the 6 immediately below them.
3) The team finishing 1st would play the teams ranked 2nd - 13th from the previous season etc.
Sort of a strength of schedule scenario the NFL uses so the team finishing last has a better chance to make the playoffs in the next season.
Top 18 make playoffs..... 18th plays 17th (one game)...... winner plays 16th...... (one game)
Top 16 then move on.... 1st vs 16th....... 2nd vs 15th etc.
I know this eliminates rivalries etc...... but as I said..... insomnia makes the mind do crazy things.
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Post by jetsorbust on Jan 10, 2012 9:17:44 GMT -6
jmt21 - It's obviously not going to happen, but to be honest I don't mind it.
The thing that I think every fan agrees they want to see is a home and home with every team. That much should be a given no matter what happens.
Personally, I don't think the NHLPA truly cared much about the unfair playoffs structure, but I do! So I like that your plan eliminates the unbalanced divisions mess.
Having said that, travel would almost certainly be increased which I think the players and owners wish to avoid (it costs time and money). To me, the voted down 7/8 team divisions were a good idea, but one which needs to rectify the unfair chances of making the playoffs.
If the league wants to expand, great, but until then it truly is unfair.
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Post by TheDeuce on Jan 10, 2012 14:30:40 GMT -6
I like the it. It immediately reminded me of the NFL scheme where strong teams play strong teams the following season.
You don't have to play another team a whole bunch of times to create rivalries. I'd wager the Bomber-Rider rivalry is a lot stronger since we've been in the East and have been playing them only twice a year.
m.
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