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Post by iceland2018 on May 9, 2023 17:33:15 GMT -6
I know construction started in 2014 but they gave them 3 number 1's before construction started. They gave Toronto Matthews. They wanted to give the Oilers McDavid to make 100% sure the arena sold out every night given how contentious getting it passed was. Calgary doesn't always sell out and in the 4th season of the new Edmonton arena WITH McDavid before covid hit they average 17,510 attendance in 34 games out of a capacity of 18,347. Without McDavid it would have been worse and made it harder to sucker Calgary into a new arena too eventually. The bottom line, is that if the NHL did indeed "rig" drafts, there is no way they give four #1 picks to Edmonton in six years. It is not in the best interests of the league. Aside from that, Arizona would ahve certainly had at least two #1 overall picks, considering the state of that franchise. The NHL would have rigged the lottery to give the #1 pick to cities like NYC, Chicago, LA, Boston, Detroit, Philadelphia, and Boston for the past 30 years. -Rangers won only once -LA has never won -Chicago won twice -Boston won once -Detroit has never won -Philadelphia has never won Lets looks at small markets: -Edmonton has won four times -Ottawa has won twice -Pittsburgh has won twice -Buffalo has won twice
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Post by mikecubs on May 10, 2023 3:43:41 GMT -6
I know construction started in 2014 but they gave them 3 number 1's before construction started. They gave Toronto Matthews. They wanted to give the Oilers McDavid to make 100% sure the arena sold out every night given how contentious getting it passed was. Calgary doesn't always sell out and in the 4th season of the new Edmonton arena WITH McDavid before covid hit they average 17,510 attendance in 34 games out of a capacity of 18,347. Without McDavid it would have been worse and made it harder to sucker Calgary into a new arena too eventually. The bottom line, is that if the NHL did indeed "rig" drafts, there is no way they give four #1 picks to Edmonton in six years. It is not in the best interests of the league. Aside from that, Arizona would ahve certainly had at least two #1 overall picks, considering the state of that franchise. The NHL would have rigged the lottery to give the #1 pick to cities like NYC, Chicago, LA, Boston, Detroit, Philadelphia, and Boston for the past 30 years. -Rangers won only once -LA has never won -Chicago won twice -Boston won once -Detroit has never won -Philadelphia has never won Lets looks at small markets: -Edmonton has won four times -Ottawa has won twice -Pittsburgh has won twice -Buffalo has won twice It was totally in the leagues best interest. Edmonton is 7th in franchise value. Rexall Place was a pit. With Edmonton getting a new arena Calgary will almost certainly get one. Calgary in a slightly bigger city with MANY more headquarters ranks 21st currently. If Edmonton was in the old arena they'd be below that. When Calgary gets a new arena they will top Edmonton. They always beat them when it was a fair fight when the both had crappy buildings. Taking 2 20 something ranked franchises and moving them into the top 10 is a total business win market size aside. Same with Pittsburgh. They rank 15th worth a hair less than $1B. If they were in the old arena they'd be near last in the league and worth around $400M less. I don't think the NBA and NHL rig every draft some are probably legit but will when there is something at steak like a once in a lifetime talent(not just a mere all star regular number 1 pick) a TV deal/new arena/a great string of Chicago vs. New York matchups, a great story line like LeBron returns home to redeem himself. There is no way Cleveland won that many lotteries with such low odds. The last one was very rigged because blew their 2nd win on Anthony Bennett and they need one more win so LeBron would come home to complete the story book. I myself magically predicted it at the time. Dwayne Wade started breaking down and Miami was getting old so it was obvious LeBron would leave for someplace else. They didn't want LeBron(maybe the best or 2nd best player in their history) to be the guy who ditched his hometown team and was hated. Matter no what he accomplished his legacy would be "I'm taking my talents to Miami, screw my hometown". This is the type of year both leagues would rig it since you have such rare talents being number 1 vs years with other number 1 picks. You can believe what you want to believe. Almost everyone knew last night was going to happen. Bettman was Stearn's number 2. The apple don't fall far from the tree. Rigging it for Arizona in the Auston Matthews draft would have been way too obvious for even a league like the NHL or NBA. Arizona is Bettman's pet project. On that there is the risk that since Arizona is so broke with Matthews they couldn't surround him with enough talent since they take on so many long term injured contracts and he'd leave and Arizona would be worse off compare if they never had him.
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Post by iceland2018 on May 10, 2023 22:18:25 GMT -6
The bottom line, is that if the NHL did indeed "rig" drafts, there is no way they give four #1 picks to Edmonton in six years. It is not in the best interests of the league. Aside from that, Arizona would ahve certainly had at least two #1 overall picks, considering the state of that franchise. The NHL would have rigged the lottery to give the #1 pick to cities like NYC, Chicago, LA, Boston, Detroit, Philadelphia, and Boston for the past 30 years. -Rangers won only once -LA has never won -Chicago won twice -Boston won once -Detroit has never won -Philadelphia has never won Lets looks at small markets:-Edmonton has won four times -Ottawa has won twice -Pittsburgh has won twice -Buffalo has won twice It was totally in the leagues best interest. Edmonton is 7th in franchise value. Rexall Place was a pit. With Edmonton getting a new arena Calgary will almost certainly get one. Calgary in a slightly bigger city with MANY more headquarters ranks 21st currently. Taking 2 20 something ranked franchises and moving them into the top 10 is a total business win market size aside. Same with Pittsburgh. They rank 15th worth a hair less than $1B. If they were in the old arena they'd be near last in the league and worth around $400M less. It does not matter how your theory is spun, it makes absolutely no business sense for the NHL to rig the Draft lottery, only for small market Canadian teams to win said lottery, especially when a generational player is involved. The NHL loses money at the end of the day, by not having a player like Connor McDavid in a major American media market like New York or Chicago. I'd certainly love to see concrete evidence that the NHL Draft lottery is rigged, other than some convoluted conspiracy theories. In my lifetime, the only rigged event in major league sports, was the 2002 NBA playoff series between Sacramento and the Lakers.
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Post by mikecubs on May 11, 2023 7:03:12 GMT -6
It was totally in the leagues best interest. Edmonton is 7th in franchise value. Rexall Place was a pit. With Edmonton getting a new arena Calgary will almost certainly get one. Calgary in a slightly bigger city with MANY more headquarters ranks 21st currently. Taking 2 20 something ranked franchises and moving them into the top 10 is a total business win market size aside. Same with Pittsburgh. They rank 15th worth a hair less than $1B. If they were in the old arena they'd be near last in the league and worth around $400M less. It does not matter how your theory is spun, it makes absolutely no business sense for the NHL to rig the Draft lottery, only for small market Canadian teams to win said lottery, especially when a generational player is involved. The NHL loses money at the end of the day, by not having a player like Connor McDavid in a major American media market like New York or Chicago. I'd certainly love to see concrete evidence that the NHL Draft lottery is rigged, other than some convoluted conspiracy theories. In my lifetime, the only rigged event in major league sports, was the 2002 NBA playoff series between Sacramento and the Lakers. In that rare case it was worth it because to get the new arenas/move the franchise values to top 10/15 from the bottom inspite of being so small. If they already had the arenas they would not have done it because you are right a big market otherwise would be better. Totally agree with you there. The NBA did similar with New Orleans though the had a modern arena. After Hurricane Katrina they were league owned coming off playing 2 seasons in Oklahoma City as a temp place and Stern from some reason loved New Orleans despite poor support before the hurricane. They hit the jackpot when the New Orleans Saints owner bought them. 1st draft he was given a generational talent in Anthony Davis. Same thing with Cleveland with LeBrons storybook return home. Usually they will rig it for a big market generational talent because as you say it makes more sense but there are RARE cases when it makes sense to rig it for a small market(new arenas) needing to reward someone for buying a team or saving the reputation of your leagues star player(LeBron/Cleveland) Again they did the same thing for Pittsburgh. They were going to move and the NHL wanted to save that market. So they changed the rules and weighted the odds then did an unsupervised drawing with Bettman emerging from behind closed doors announcing the Pittsburgh Penguins magically winning the Crosby sweepstakes. 5 years later they had their new arena and for a while became a top 10 team in franchise value and still rank in the top 15. Look at the generation stars and how it went Crosby(shady Bettman emerging from behind closed doors announcing Pittsburgh won, Pittsburgh got new arena 5 years later, total financial turn around for team) McDavid(Helped with new arena and will probably get Calgary a new arena. If the Oilers sucked after the new arena opened and had trouble drawing everyone would say why should we build Calgary a new arena the Oilers new arena didn't help them) Matthews(went to big market Toronto) McDavid(went to Chicago when they absolutely needed to be on TV due to espn paying $1B for TV rights with cable dying due to cord cutting) You make a good point 2002 playoffs was rigged. Why was it rigged? Because LA is the 2nd biggest market and had the 2 super stars Kobe and Shaq that drew the big eye balls for tv. Sacramento was a small market with mere all stars like Chris Weber and Mike Bibby. Not generational talent that everyone wanted to watch. If you are willing to rig games then why not where stars go? Just common sense. Do you really think for 1 second Chicago could have won the Derek Rose lottery with 1.7% odds? Or Cleveland win 3 times with such low odds? LOL That's the culture Bettman came from. Sports are a business with the goal of maximizing $$$ especially from TV. And having grand new palaces to play in to extract maximum $$$ from fans. Pay attention to next Tuesdays NBA lottery. Do you really think the french 7 foot 3 freak of nature is going to Charlotte, Indiana or Portland? Come on. He's going to Houston, Chicago or maybe Washington(small distance chance for Detroit since its top 15 market and is a legacy team). Chicago will be allowed to move up to at least top 4 because Orlando gets their pick if it's below top 4 from the failed Vucevic trade. The NBA's old TV deal is running out. New York and the Lakers are playoff teams and they are going to want Chicago to be the same to maximize what they can ask for.
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Post by mikecubs on May 11, 2023 7:49:59 GMT -6
One other rigged lottery I forgot about. In 1997 big market/legacy team Boston Celtics had the best odds of winning the Tim Duncan sweepstakes. But they were horrible misrun at the time with Rick Patino as head coach. He was a great college coach but was in way over his head in the NBA. At that time you could leave a team in free agency after only 4 years.LOL He would have left that mess as soon as he could. San Antonio was playing literally in a failed football stadium the Alamodome which was supposed to draw an NFL team and never did. They wanted a new arena. There were tons of relocation rumors(ala the Pittsburgh Penguins) They gave them Duncan he won a title in his second year. The arena had to pass a PUBLIC vote(usually in both the states and Canada politicians will ram the deal though without vote) The vote passed with people high on the championship win and in 2002 the Spurs had their modern arena in a small market but one of the top 5 growing cities. They won another 4 titles. Whenever you get a Chicago Bulls 1.7% miracle win the NBA will always say but look San Antonio won the Tim Duncan sweepstakes like you are saying with Edmonton. It can't be rigged don't believe your lying eyes. Out of the Duncan draft they got a new arena in a fast growing city plus cover to rig lotteries for big market teams. Plus avoided embarrassing the Celtics in losing Duncan after 4 years. On Cleveland miracle wins In 2011 after they lost James their odds of winning and getting Kryie Irving(lebron's number 2 on the title team) was 2.8%. In 2013 their odds were 15.6% on the pick they blew on Anthony Bennett. Now with Bennett being a bust there was no way LeBron was coming home to save his legacy/the story book. NBA teams need 3 stars especially with Golden State lurking. Big problem Irving got good enough to lead them to enough wins just to fall short of the playoffs. They only had 1.7% odds. A miracle was needed. They got it. Best of all when they had the lottery Cleveland's owner sent his young son who had cancer. He wore a cute "magic" bow tie for each draft. People loved it. Miracle boy with cancer from city with endless title drought in NFL, NBA, MLB brings disgraced local super star how to end drought. ESPN did a 30 for 30 series on it and this magic boy.
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Post by mikecubs on May 11, 2023 13:51:52 GMT -6
NHL Insider Reports ‘Smart’ Hockey Minds Are Buying Into A Draft Lottery Conspiracy TheoryThe start of the most recent NHL season unofficially marked the beginning of one of the biggest storylines of the impending offseason, as it wasn’t a stretch to suggest teams that weren’t serious contenders for the Stanley Cup had some incentive to tank in the hopes of landing the generational talent who is Connor Bedard. When everything was said and done, 11 of the league’s franchises were in the running to secure the top overall pick that would give them the right to draft the phenom who’s made quite a name for himself in the WHL and as a member of Canada’s junior national team. The Ducks were the odds-on favorite to walk away with that pick when the NHL Draft Lottery was held on Monday night with an 18.5% chance, followed by the Blue Jackets (13.5%) and the Blackhawks (11.5%). When everything was said and done, Chicago managed to pull off the minor upset after Columbus earned the bronze and Anaheim received the silver, which means Connor Bedard will be heading to the Windy City next season barring some truly unpredictable twist. The Blackhawks wasted no time cashing in on their new asset thanks to the insane amount of season tickets the franchise was able to move after officially securing the No. 1 spot, although plenty of fans asserted they shouldn’t have even been in contention due to the team’s role in a sexual assault scandal it was accused of covering up. It’s pretty obvious the NHL is pleased Bedard will be playing for an Original Six team located in the fairly lucrative Chicago market, although that very convenient development also led to a number of conspiracy theorists alleging the draft lottery was rigged in their favor. Based on what Elliotte Friedman had to say on a recent episode of the 32 Thoughts podcast, those allegations aren’t limited to anonymous Twitter users who threw on a tinfoil hat after the lottery came to an end, as the insider asserted there are also a number of anonymous figures around the league who’ve echoed the same sentiment, saying: “I was shocked. I can’t tell you how many people around the league who I consider to be very smart people were convinced that it was rigged. I know people go on the internet and they’re all mad. They’re like, ‘RIGGED! RIGGED! THIS WAS FIXED!’ Fans are fans. I don’t really have any problem with that. People react very emotionally. But people in the league—like on teams and stuff—were like, ‘This is rigged.’ I’m like, ‘Guys, come on.'” At the end of the day, it’s hard to imagine the NHL actually rigged the draft lottery in Chicago’s favor, but the truth has never stopped a good conspiracy theory from catching on. brobible.com/sports/article/nhl-draft-lottery-blackhawks-connor-bedard-rigged-conspiracy/
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Post by mikecubs on May 11, 2023 14:00:35 GMT -6
It wasn't just Bettman in on it. The entire 32 owners were in on it and it's lower team executives complaining. As I said the NHL never had real TV money before last year. All 32 owners want to keep it. What's the number 1 thing you can do for your TV partners paying $1B. Make Chicago good. They are the number 1 US draw by a mile. They must go deep in the playoffs and must have the Winter Classics and be on a ton during the year. You need Chicago on almost constant (mini)dynasty mode
What is it like to have a billion dollar TV deal? The rich and mid market teams make a killing. The lowly butt of jokes Coyotes and Panthers made modest profits for the 1st time ever according to forbes last year. Florida made $4.7M dollars, Arizona made $5.8M.
Since 2013 the panthers financial history (the date below is forbes when the published, so they are 1 season behind)
Forbes is always very conservative on losses and franchise values for every team in every sport. So I'm sure past Arizona/Florida losses were worse
2013 -7.7M 2014 -15.6M 2015 -20.2 2016 -15.4 2017 -11 2018 -21 2019 -21 2020 -29 2021 +4.7
Arizona
2013 -8.9M 2014 -4.6M 2015 -4.5M 2016 -8M 2017 -19M 2018 -11M 2019 -15M 2020 -17M 2021 -33M 2022 +5.8M
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