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Post by mikecubs on Jun 4, 2015 22:48:07 GMT -6
I remember when the NHL originally announced in 1989, that they were going to expand to at least 26 teams by the end of the 90s. Milwaukee was the frontrunner. The Bradley Centre was only a couple of years old, College Hockey is huge in Wisconsin, and they would ahve a natural rivalry with the Blackhawks. Unfortunately, the market is saturated with pro sports, and with a metro population of less than 2,000,000 people, I can't see the NHL coming there anytime soon. From what I've heard the arena won't even have an ice plant and the Milwaukee Admirals won't be able to play there. Also the arena will seat only 17,000 for NBA(since no one cares for the Bucks) which means you'd be down to 16,000 for NHL at least. From the pictures I've seen of it the seats seem really close for NBA so I think if they went with the current bowl in the renderings and added an ice plant you'd still have a horseshoe arena where there would be crap seats on one end(like Barclays Center). Unlike Barclays Center Milwaukee doesn't have an insane 144 fortune 1000 companies like New York area does meaning they couldn't make up for the bad seats with luxury boxes sales like at Barclays. But you are right the biggest problem is the city is too small for 3 teams. It's probably too small for 2. If the Bucks get this arena they will still be barely surviveable and a better market than probably only Memphis and New Orleans. Throw in the fact Milwaukee's population is stagnant. There is just no growth because it's an ugly boring dunghole like the other crappy rust belt cities (Cleveland, Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, Buffalo). I still wouldn't 100% count out NHL. There is a way it could work if the NHL wanted and the Bucks owners were interested in an NHL team. Bettman could come to Wisconsin and say to our idiot Glendale like politicians(Scott Walker, Scott Fitzgerald, John Nygren) "why don't you outright shut down the University of Wisconsin education system? You don't need any colleges. Take that money and give it to the Bucks/NHL team to make up for the losses from the lack of population." They probably would go along with that.
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Post by wolfmannick on Jun 5, 2015 2:03:53 GMT -6
I don't feel like going back to quote whoever said that Glendale is sick of the Coyotes, but here. If the city actually votes to stop paying the lease the team leaves, until then the team stays. Same thing with the Panthers, if the city votes to let them leave they leave tomorrow, until then they stay. Anyone think I'm wrong here?
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Post by mikecubs on Jun 5, 2015 12:16:07 GMT -6
I don't know if Glendale can stop paying the Coyotes even if they wanted unless they went bankrupt. A deal is a deal. I'm sure the NHL would sue them if they outright stopped payments.
In Florida the Panthers are asking for a baleout to cover hockey loses. If the city says no nothing will happen because unlike Glendale the ENTIRE OPERATION is profitable thanks to the concerts so people would still want to own something like that even with the hockey losses. Difference between Glendale and Florida is in Glendale the it's just not the hockey team that is the money loser the entire freaking operation is a money pit because they don't draw many concerts either.
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Post by Bruinsfan on Jun 5, 2015 15:58:50 GMT -6
I don't know if Glendale can stop paying the Coyotes even if they wanted unless they went bankrupt. A deal is a deal. I'm sure the NHL would sue them if they outright stopped payments. In Florida the Panthers are asking for a baleout to cover hockey loses. If the city says no nothing will happen because unlike Glendale the ENTIRE OPERATION is profitable thanks to the concerts so people would still want to own something like that even with the hockey losses. Difference between Glendale and Florida is in Glendale the it's just not the hockey team that is the money loser the entire freaking operation is a money pit because they don't draw many concerts either. They are the government they can get out of a contract...they might ahve to pay fair market value for it though
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Post by mikecubs on Jun 5, 2015 16:26:24 GMT -6
Well that don't help then if they still have to pay. What would be the point of paying but still losing the team?
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Post by Lions67 on Jun 5, 2015 20:10:00 GMT -6
i believe in what Jetstender just posted.
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Post by Bruinsfan on Jun 5, 2015 21:59:24 GMT -6
Well that don't help then if they still have to pay. What would be the point of paying but still losing the team? Fair market value is the key in eminent domain....they lose a property interet...whats the fair market value of a team that loses 30 million and doesnt do its due dilligance to live up to their end of the lease? Might be a net 0 and they owe nothing. Remember this post.
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Post by Bruinsfan on Jun 5, 2015 22:16:45 GMT -6
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Post by wolfmannick on Jun 6, 2015 11:14:06 GMT -6
^ oh yeah you're a lawyer or what not
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Post by Bruinsfan on Jun 6, 2015 15:59:41 GMT -6
^ oh yeah you're a lawyer or what not yes i am a lawyer or what not.
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Post by JETStender on Jun 6, 2015 18:15:14 GMT -6
i believe in what Jetstender just posted. I have nothing to do with it. It's Bettman's comments. But you can look back and it's 100% accurate without actually saying what's going on.
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Post by wolfmannick on Jun 6, 2015 23:17:48 GMT -6
^ the only thing is I don't think the nhl had any intention of returning to winnipeg they only did out of necessity. I believe the same applies for Quebec, don't believe me? Look at the announcement and bet and body language and attitude during the whole conference.
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Post by mikecubs on Jun 7, 2015 0:37:06 GMT -6
^ I wanted to believe differently but you are correct. At the time there was no other place to put an NHL team. Do you think Bettman would ever say to a suburban sunbelt like Glendale/Sunrise you have to sell X number of tickets(not necessary 13,000 at a high price but say even 10,000 at an ok price) or this won't work?
Now Vegas has an arena and Seattle looks like they will have one soon. Quebec made a huge mistake. They did need a new arena but they shouldn't have made it so fancy/expensive. 18,000+ seats is too many seats if Quebec even did get a guarantee. What they should have done was built a 17,000 seat arena and made it less fancy. Somewhat in between what they got now and the bear bones MTS centre. What they thought was look how well Winnipeg did, we will be similar since the cities are similar. Let's build an arena without a guarantee of a team. The NHL won't be that stupid to turn us down. It would be fine to think that if this was a sport run like the NFL, MLB or NBA. The NHL is a very different animal. NHL is a joke of a sport thanks to the awful leadership and it's just not Bettman but the dumb owners who keep him. They think he's a god because he got a 200M tv deal in the US which is unlike anything they've ever seen. The thing is anyone could have gotten the deal because like TV rights for sports are like gold. It was nothing special Bettman did. The owners think otherwise and keep the clown. NHL needs to realize he's a fraud and he's bad for business. The NHL is leaving a lot of money on the table with all his screw ups. He should be fired. They should try and steel away the NBA's deputy commissioner or someone high up in the NBA's front office.
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Post by jetsorbust on Jun 9, 2015 12:41:37 GMT -6
^ the only thing is I don't think the nhl had any intention of returning to winnipeg they only did out of necessity. I believe the same applies for Quebec, don't believe me? Look at the announcement and bet and body language and attitude during the whole conference. Agreed.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2015 16:07:20 GMT -6
^ I wanted to believe differently but you are correct. At the time there was no other place to put an NHL team. Do you think Bettman would ever say to a suburban sunbelt like Glendale/Sunrise you have to sell X number of tickets(not necessary 13,000 at a high price but say even 10,000 at an ok price) or this won't work? Now Vegas has an arena and Seattle looks like they will have one soon. Quebec made a huge mistake. They did need a new arena but they shouldn't have made it so fancy/expensive. 18,000+ seats is too many seats if Quebec even did get a guarantee. What they should have done was built a 17,000 seat arena and made it less fancy. Somewhat in between what they got now and the bear bones MTS centre. What they thought was look how well Winnipeg did, we will be similar since the cities are similar. Let's build an arena without a guarantee of a team. The NHL won't be that stupid to turn us down. It would be fine to think that if this was a sport run like the NFL, MLB or NBA. The NHL is a very different animal. NHL is a joke of a sport thanks to the awful leadership and it's just not Bettman but the dumb owners who keep him. They think he's a god because he got a 200M tv deal in the US which is unlike anything they've ever seen. The thing is anyone could have gotten the deal because like TV rights for sports are like gold. It was nothing special Bettman did. The owners think otherwise and keep the clown. NHL needs to realize he's a fraud and he's bad for business. The NHL is leaving a lot of money on the table with all his screw ups. He should be fired. They should try and steel away the NBA's deputy commissioner or someone high up in the NBA's front office. They will get a team eventually. It took Winnipeg 7 years after the MTS Centre was build to land an NHL team. Quebec has not even finished theirs yet. Winnipeg also has been a huge success. It`s not going to be done overnight. It`s going to happen though.
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