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Post by lenny on Mar 7, 2018 15:56:04 GMT -6
There are some contracts we will shed. the biggest - Toby Enstrom at 5.8. I did not like Little's contract. But so be it. Laine has another year of his ELC so we can save this year. He could sign a contract like McDavid did which takes effect after his ELC is up. Wheel's is up next year. Morrissey's ELC is up this year. With Buff's 7.x contract I don't see Trouba inking a long term contract. This is his arbitration year. The arbitrator will give him a certain amount. To me, Trouba with his injuries, is almost looking like a Bogo with his injuries. He missed 17 games year 1, 17 games year 2, he played a full-season 2015-16, he missed 22 games 2016-17. He might get in to play the last 10 games this year which would put him on the mark to miss another 20+ games. Sorry. I wouldn't stake longterm on him. I would be looking for a trade after season's end and I'm certain Chevy could get a nice first rounder plus a decent roster player for people who never expressed a desire to play somewhere else.
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Post by sting on Mar 7, 2018 18:38:42 GMT -6
It's the Draisaitl contract that is the problem. How is Laine's agent going to accept less than the $9 million he got when clearly he is better than Draisaitl Look at the last three big deals Chevy got signed. If you want long term success from both sides, you can't rip off your players, but you also can't put yourself ahead of the team. If Laine truly is worth 10, I expect him to sign for 8ish. I think this is a big reason why we won't see Trouba signed. The Jets want to keep a certain type of player and it's not the selfish type Wow, you have no clue that Trouba is selfish. You have no idea what goes into the contract talks and how much of it has to do with the agent etc. Each player has agents, financial advisors to help them. Teams don't keep players forever, each player has to think of themselves first. If they didn't players like Crosby and McDavid would play for a million and stack the teams. Would you call Toews selfish? The contracts him and Kane took have hurt the Hawks. The players think of themselves as much as the teams think of themselves. Guys like Hutch and Petan could easily play on some team in the NHL but the Jets choose to keep them for their own benefit at the expense of the players benefit. The Jets sent Ladd one of the most popular players in the locker room packing despite him wanting to stay. It's a business for both sides, so to suggest Trouba is selfish based on what you think he is like with out knowing him is wrong.
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Post by Grumpz on Mar 7, 2018 18:51:41 GMT -6
Look at the last three big deals Chevy got signed. If you want long term success from both sides, you can't rip off your players, but you also can't put yourself ahead of the team. If Laine truly is worth 10, I expect him to sign for 8ish. I think this is a big reason why we won't see Trouba signed. The Jets want to keep a certain type of player and it's not the selfish type Wow, you have no clue that Trouba is selfish. You have no idea what goes into the contract talks and how much of it has to do with the agent etc. Each player has agents, financial advisors to help them. Teams don't keep players forever, each player has to think of themselves first. If they didn't players like Crosby and McDavid would play for a million and stack the teams. Would you call Toews selfish? The contracts him and Kane took have hurt the Hawks. The players think of themselves as much as the teams think of themselves. Guys like Hutch and Petan could easily play on some team in the NHL but the Jets choose to keep them for their own benefit at the expense of the players benefit. The Jets sent Ladd one of the most popular players in the locker room packing despite him wanting to stay. It's a business for both sides, so to suggest Trouba is selfish based on what you think he is like with out knowing him is wrong. We all saw how things played out when he HELD OUT (not sure how often unselfish team players hold out), and we all heard what his justifications were right from his agents mouth. None of that was speculation, so I stand by it. If he doesn't sign it will be because he won't sign. And that'll be because just like when he played as good as 5 mill, but wanted 7, he'll want every single penny he thinks he's worth. Unlike Buff, Scheif and Ehlers.
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Post by sting on Mar 7, 2018 19:19:00 GMT -6
Wow, you have no clue that Trouba is selfish. You have no idea what goes into the contract talks and how much of it has to do with the agent etc. Each player has agents, financial advisors to help them. Teams don't keep players forever, each player has to think of themselves first. If they didn't players like Crosby and McDavid would play for a million and stack the teams. Would you call Toews selfish? The contracts him and Kane took have hurt the Hawks. The players think of themselves as much as the teams think of themselves. Guys like Hutch and Petan could easily play on some team in the NHL but the Jets choose to keep them for their own benefit at the expense of the players benefit. The Jets sent Ladd one of the most popular players in the locker room packing despite him wanting to stay. It's a business for both sides, so to suggest Trouba is selfish based on what you think he is like with out knowing him is wrong. We all saw how things played out when he HELD OUT (not sure how often unselfish team players hold out), and we all heard what his justifications were right from his agents mouth. None of that was speculation, so I stand by it. If he doesn't sign it will be because he won't sign. And that'll be because just like when he played as good as 5 mill, but wanted 7, he'll want every single penny he thinks he's worth. Unlike Buff, Scheif and Ehlers. I guess Hawerchuk was a selfish player. He walked on Buffalo, Messier sitting out until January. Bobby Hull had contract problems with the Hawks. Bunch of bums aren't they? And yes you watching from your home is speculation. Here is a little inside info, what a agent says isn't always what the player thinks. It's part of the tactics. The truth is you honestly don't know what happened between the Jets and Trouba's camp. Agents use the media all the time.
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Post by Grumpz on Mar 7, 2018 19:47:23 GMT -6
We all saw how things played out when he HELD OUT (not sure how often unselfish team players hold out), and we all heard what his justifications were right from his agents mouth. None of that was speculation, so I stand by it. If he doesn't sign it will be because he won't sign. And that'll be because just like when he played as good as 5 mill, but wanted 7, he'll want every single penny he thinks he's worth. Unlike Buff, Scheif and Ehlers. I guess Hawerchuk was a selfish player. He walked on Buffalo, Messier sitting out until January. Bobby Hull had contract problems with the Hawks. Bunch of bums aren't they? And yes you watching from your home is speculation. Here is a little inside info, what a agent says isn't always what the player thinks. It's part of the tactics. The truth is you honestly don't know what happened between the Jets and Trouba's camp. Agents use the media all the time. He held out. That says it all.
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Post by sting on Mar 7, 2018 19:56:32 GMT -6
I guess Hawerchuk was a selfish player. He walked on Buffalo, Messier sitting out until January. Bobby Hull had contract problems with the Hawks. Bunch of bums aren't they? And yes you watching from your home is speculation. Here is a little inside info, what a agent says isn't always what the player thinks. It's part of the tactics. The truth is you honestly don't know what happened between the Jets and Trouba's camp. Agents use the media all the time. He held out. That says it all. I will never agree with anyone that thinks Messier is selfish who held out. One of the greatest leaders and champions ever and that says it all. Also Bobby Hull is the reason Winnipeg has pro hockey and he held out. I disagree with you completely.
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Post by Grumpz on Mar 7, 2018 20:03:24 GMT -6
He held out. That says it all. I will never agree with anyone that thinks Messier is selfish who held out. One of the greatest leaders and champions ever and that says it all. Also Bobby Hull is the reason Winnipeg has pro hockey and he held out. I disagree with you completely. Sounds good, and hopefully I'm wrong, but the only way Trouba signs here is for a discount, and if he won't take it, he'll get traded. That simple. The Jets have built what they've built by not signing guys to what the market deems they are worth, once they cleared themselves from ATL garbage. And it's the reason for the hold out, not the hold out on it's own.
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Post by sting on Mar 7, 2018 21:36:06 GMT -6
I will never agree with anyone that thinks Messier is selfish who held out. One of the greatest leaders and champions ever and that says it all. Also Bobby Hull is the reason Winnipeg has pro hockey and he held out. I disagree with you completely. Sounds good, and hopefully I'm wrong, but the only way Trouba signs here is for a discount, and if he won't take it, he'll get traded. That simple. The Jets have built what they've built by not signing guys to what the market deems they are worth, once they cleared themselves from ATL garbage. And it's the reason for the hold out, not the hold out on it's own. I was watching a New York Mets game today and many players are unsigned and they said vets are no longer getting paid for what they have done in the past. They said do to analytics the young guys are being paid on potential and the market for older players is correcting itself and many stars are unsigned. Back to hockey, I wonder if the young guys are being instructed by the agents to get the max now with the reason being they are no longer going to get the big deals when they are in their thirties. Some times a team gets the good deal and sometimes the player wins (Enstrom) I think it's 50\50 on Trouba staying. If the team can make it work, they will, if not they have no choice but to deal him. Question for you, if you were a player and worked hard to get where you are, would you take a discount? I think no matter the job most won't take a discount unless they have no choice.
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Post by Grumpz on Mar 8, 2018 8:34:50 GMT -6
Sounds good, and hopefully I'm wrong, but the only way Trouba signs here is for a discount, and if he won't take it, he'll get traded. That simple. The Jets have built what they've built by not signing guys to what the market deems they are worth, once they cleared themselves from ATL garbage. And it's the reason for the hold out, not the hold out on it's own. I was watching a New York Mets game today and many players are unsigned and they said vets are no longer getting paid for what they have done in the past. They said do to analytics the young guys are being paid on potential and the market for older players is correcting itself and many stars are unsigned. Back to hockey, I wonder if the young guys are being instructed by the agents to get the max now with the reason being they are no longer going to get the big deals when they are in their thirties. Some times a team gets the good deal and sometimes the player wins (Enstrom) I think it's 50\50 on Trouba staying. If the team can make it work, they will, if not they have no choice but to deal him. Question for you, if you were a player and worked hard to get where you are, would you take a discount? I think no matter the job most won't take a discount unless they have no choice. Thank you for posing the question because I've been asked that by others and my response is always the same. As a pro athlete or me or you, or a movie star, it doesn't matter. On an 7 or 8 yr deal, what can you do with 9 million per, that you can't do with 7.5? What does it say to your team, the owners and the fans, when you leave 1.5 million dollars on the table, to allow the team to spread the money around? At some point, the amount of money becomes so large, that walking away to make more becomes nothing but selfish. Turning your back on a team that drafted you and a dressing room that groomed you because you think you should get 32k biweekly instead of 27k is beyond ridiculous. So to your question, as an athlete making millions upon millions, would I leave money on the table? If I was treated as well as TNSE treats all of it's staff from the bottom up, and the discount had absolutely no impact on anything accept me owning 5 houses and 7 cars vs. 9 houses and 10 cars, then yes. I'd take a discount. You bet your ass I would.
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Post by sting on Mar 8, 2018 10:02:07 GMT -6
I was watching a New York Mets game today and many players are unsigned and they said vets are no longer getting paid for what they have done in the past. They said do to analytics the young guys are being paid on potential and the market for older players is correcting itself and many stars are unsigned. Back to hockey, I wonder if the young guys are being instructed by the agents to get the max now with the reason being they are no longer going to get the big deals when they are in their thirties. Some times a team gets the good deal and sometimes the player wins (Enstrom) I think it's 50\50 on Trouba staying. If the team can make it work, they will, if not they have no choice but to deal him. Question for you, if you were a player and worked hard to get where you are, would you take a discount? I think no matter the job most won't take a discount unless they have no choice. Thank you for posing the question because I've been asked that by others and my response is always the same. As a pro athlete or me or you, or a movie star, it doesn't matter. On an 7 or 8 yr deal, what can you do with 9 million per, that you can't do with 7.5? What does it say to your team, the owners and the fans, when you leave 1.5 million dollars on the table, to allow the team to spread the money around? At some point, the amount of money becomes so large, that walking away to make more becomes nothing but selfish. Turning your back on a team that drafted you and a dressing room that groomed you because you think you should get 32k biweekly instead of 27k is beyond ridiculous. So to your question, as an athlete making millions upon millions, would I leave money on the table? If I was treated as well as TNSE treats all of it's staff from the bottom up, and the discount had absolutely no impact on anything accept me owning 5 houses and 7 cars vs. 9 houses and 10 cars, then yes. I'd take a discount. You bet your ass I would. Fair enough. Back to Trouba, if he feels that playing on the right side, he can be much better and True North doesn't see it that way. would that not be a serious reason to consider playing for another team where they might use him as their number 1 right D-man? If your boss wasn't using in your best position would that not make you question how much they value you? Maybe he wants to be here but feels that in the spot he is being used makes it harder to be his best?
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Post by Grumpz on Mar 8, 2018 10:34:37 GMT -6
Thank you for posing the question because I've been asked that by others and my response is always the same. As a pro athlete or me or you, or a movie star, it doesn't matter. On an 7 or 8 yr deal, what can you do with 9 million per, that you can't do with 7.5? What does it say to your team, the owners and the fans, when you leave 1.5 million dollars on the table, to allow the team to spread the money around? At some point, the amount of money becomes so large, that walking away to make more becomes nothing but selfish. Turning your back on a team that drafted you and a dressing room that groomed you because you think you should get 32k biweekly instead of 27k is beyond ridiculous. So to your question, as an athlete making millions upon millions, would I leave money on the table? If I was treated as well as TNSE treats all of it's staff from the bottom up, and the discount had absolutely no impact on anything accept me owning 5 houses and 7 cars vs. 9 houses and 10 cars, then yes. I'd take a discount. You bet your ass I would. Fair enough. Back to Trouba, if he feels that playing on the right side, he can be much better and True North doesn't see it that way. would that not be a serious reason to consider playing for another team where they might use him as their number 1 right D-man? If your boss wasn't using in your best position would that not make you question how much they value you? Maybe he wants to be here but feels that in the spot he is being used makes it harder to be his best? It wouldn't be enough to make me hold out, and throw my team under the bus. But yes, if I wasn't being used to the best of my abilities; I may reconsider my future with the team. However, Trouba came back after his hold out and has been playing the right side and been getting top pairing minutes. So what excuses are left that would hold up his signing? And we know it's not a matter of Chevy not trying because there was an interview with Touba in the preseason where a reporter asked about negotiations and Trouba said his agent and Chevy had talked briefly but nothing came of it. Which gives us 2 choices. The Jets are trying to sign him, but the guy who held out won't sign, or the Jets who've signed all of there first round picks so far, have no interest in keeping Trouba ling term. Either way, it's up to Trouba to sign long term, and I'm just not getting a warm and fuzzy feeling from him.
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Post by lenny on Mar 10, 2018 16:35:19 GMT -6
40 goals and counting!
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Post by babs44 on Mar 10, 2018 17:38:29 GMT -6
Most of us living here can make more money elsewhere. Some leave to chase the cash. Why would pro athletes be any different ? Chevy is in a position now that if a player wants go he'll swing a nice trade and keep stocking the shelves. The players that get what's going on here will probably play for a little less. Those expensive houses they are living are probably at least double elsewhere. 1 or 2 hour commutes to the rink ? Not here ! Worrying about crazies in schools ? Not so much here. I can keep going.
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Post by sting on Mar 11, 2018 14:22:26 GMT -6
Most of us living here can make more money elsewhere. Some leave to chase the cash. Why would pro athletes be any different ? Chevy is in a position now that if a player wants go he'll swing a nice trade and keep stocking the shelves. The players that get what's going on here will probably play for a little less. Those expensive houses they are living are probably at least double elsewhere. 1 or 2 hour commutes to the rink ? Not here ! Worrying about crazies in schools ? Not so much here. I can keep going. Wheeler and maybe Buf have kids going to school here. Most guys here are young and live in condos. If they are in another city, houses cost more but they also sell for more when the player needs to sell. It's not so easy for Chevy to swing a trade as you say. Salary cap and no trade contracts make it hard to do. Today's NHL is a great deal harder to swing big trades with cap issues. That's why the Jets have to go with draft, develop and resign approach with occasional trade that Chevy has made over the last 7 years.
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Post by jetsblu44 on Mar 11, 2018 14:52:05 GMT -6
Sounds good, and hopefully I'm wrong, but the only way Trouba signs here is for a discount, and if he won't take it, he'll get traded. That simple. The Jets have built what they've built by not signing guys to what the market deems they are worth, once they cleared themselves from ATL garbage. And it's the reason for the hold out, not the hold out on it's own. I was watching a New York Mets game today and many players are unsigned and they said vets are no longer getting paid for what they have done in the past. They said do to analytics the young guys are being paid on potential and the market for older players is correcting itself and many stars are unsigned. Back to hockey, I wonder if the young guys are being instructed by the agents to get the max now with the reason being they are no longer going to get the big deals when they are in their thirties. Some times a team gets the good deal and sometimes the player wins (Enstrom) I think it's 50\50 on Trouba staying. If the team can make it work, they will, if not they have no choice but to deal him. Question for you, if you were a player and worked hard to get where you are, would you take a discount? I think no matter the job most won't take a discount unless they have no choice. Watching a Met game says it all.........
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