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Post by donwood on Jun 1, 2016 9:03:48 GMT -6
Storm swirls around Karmanos family over $105 million dispute involving Carolina Hurricanes loans Sons are suing the founder of Compuware over money taken from trusts DETROIT - It's a family squabble of monumental proportion. The Karmanos family, businessman Peter Karmanos and his three elder sons, are fighting over more than $100 million. The case is now in Oakland County Circuit Court. The dispute centers on Karmanos's will, which stands to give substantial amounts of money to his sons. The problem? Pete Karmanos borrowed millions of dollars from trusts, made up of Compuware stock, promised to his three sons, Peter the third, Nick and Jason. The trusts are valued at over $100 million, but over the years, Pete Sr. borrowed against the account to fund his beloved Carolina Hurricanes hockey team. He wrote a loan contract for more than $100 million, agreeing to pay interest using installments until June 29, 2022, or one year after his death. A lawsuit filed last Thursday says "on or about April 21, Peter the third ... sent his father a notice of default of balance of principal and interest on the June 2013 note." The sons claim their father "failed to timely cure such defaults and accordingly, on or about May 25, 2016 the entire balance of the June 2013 note ... more than $105 million ... would become immediately due and payable." Probate litigator Robert Zawideh of Kemp Klein says the case leaves you wondering about the Karmanos fortune's fortunes. "Well certainly the biggest indicator of money problems is when you're getting sued over nonpayment of money, the lawuit certainly suggests that but there could be other reasons as well," he said. Normally this kind of case winds up in probate court, but the Karmanos sons isntead filed a civil case in circuit court saying this is a contract dispute. Local 4 reached out to both parties in the case today. The sons had no comment. Pete Sr. did not return phone calls. www.clickondetroit.com/business/storm-swirls-around-karmanos-family-over-105-million-dispute-involving-carolina-hurricanes-loanslawsuit link: media.clickondetroit.com/document_dev/2016/05/31/Peter%20Karmanos%20Jr.%20complaint_6559992_ver1.0.pdf
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2016 10:37:57 GMT -6
Move em' to Quebec.
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Post by TheDeuce on Jun 1, 2016 11:09:37 GMT -6
Am I reading that correctly? The sons are suing the dad over money he borrowed from an entity he owns and that the sons do not presently own?
Or did I misread?
m.
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Post by USApegger on Jun 1, 2016 13:03:00 GMT -6
Am I reading that correctly? The sons are suing the dad over money he borrowed from an entity he owns and that the sons do not presently own? Or did I misread? m. No you didn't. blank ing greedy brats, I hope they never get a penny from him now
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Post by TheDeuce on Jun 1, 2016 13:31:35 GMT -6
Holy cow, I better be careful. I'm blowing my kids' inheritance on beer futures. As in the beer I'll be drinking in the near future.
I'm not even leaving them the empties! I'm reinvesting those dividends into more beer futures.
m.
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Post by phillymike on Jun 1, 2016 13:51:48 GMT -6
Simple solution:
Sell the team!
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jmt
3rd Line Checker
Posts: 219
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Post by jmt on Jun 1, 2016 16:23:31 GMT -6
I actually disagree with you guys - he setup the trust in their name specifically for the 3 of them, then he borrows against the money to invest in something that loses money because he wanted to. He did something and then took it back and anyone who says that they would be OK with this if they were one of the kids, I call BS. The trust is in their name, it's irrevocable, that's why he could only borrow against it with guarantees. As soon as he set it up, it became their money. Unfortunately at that level, court is the only way to fix or try to fix the situation.
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Post by Tim on Jun 2, 2016 6:22:21 GMT -6
I actually disagree with you guys - he setup the trust in their name specifically for the 3 of them, then he borrows against the money to invest in something that loses money because he wanted to. He did something and then took it back and anyone who says that they would be OK with this if they were one of the kids, I call BS. The trust is in their name, it's irrevocable, that's why he could only borrow against it with guarantees. As soon as he set it up, it became their money. Unfortunately at that level, court is the only way to fix or try to fix the situation. Well call B.S. on me because I would never F@#$over my father or my Family at any cost for any amount of money, that's just morals and some of us were raised with them and still use them in our day to day life, then there are the other kind of people in the world that do $ H I T like that I call them scum.
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Post by Bruinsfan on Jun 2, 2016 6:34:42 GMT -6
I will read this later and get back to you guys, it seems like he breached a duty he contracted with on the trust.
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Post by TheDeuce on Jun 2, 2016 8:55:13 GMT -6
I actually disagree with you guys - he setup the trust in their name specifically for the 3 of them, then he borrows against the money to invest in something that loses money because he wanted to. He did something and then took it back and anyone who says that they would be OK with this if they were one of the kids, I call BS. The trust is in their name, it's irrevocable, that's why he could only borrow against it with guarantees. As soon as he set it up, it became their money. Unfortunately at that level, court is the only way to fix or try to fix the situation. So my inference of "he borrowed money from an entity he owns" was incorrect. That makes a big difference. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. m.
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Post by donwood on Jun 3, 2016 22:53:21 GMT -6
Gary Lawless reported today that Karmanos has borrowed 300 Million from the NHL. This seems high since my understanding is teams can only borrow up to 50% of the team value. Even if it's in the ballpark more like 150 million, between the league loan and the trust fund "loan" that's 255 million. And this from a team losing money every year. A sale would seem the only option and with Arizona still owing the NHL money the BoG's you would think would have little sympathy.
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Post by Guardian on Jun 4, 2016 13:17:29 GMT -6
So Las Vegas gets an expansion team.
Quebec waits to be landing spot for the Hurricanes.
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Post by donwood on Jun 4, 2016 14:20:32 GMT -6
So Las Vegas gets an expansion team. Quebec waits to be landing spot for the Hurricanes. Maybe sooner then later.....
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Post by calgaryflames on Jun 5, 2016 12:50:35 GMT -6
So Las Vegas gets an expansion team. Quebec waits to be landing spot for the Hurricanes. Maybe sooner then later..... Inside source or pure speculation? I mean all that's going on right now does eerily resemble what happened with the whole PHX/WPG/ATL situation. Now it seems we have a situation with CAR/QUE/ARZ. With everybody assuming it is the Hurricanes to Quebec, I wouldn't be surprised that it is Phoenix on the move to Quebec, Hurricanes eventually shipped to Seattle once the arena is sorted out. In my eyes, the Coyotes appear to be the ones in 'imminent' danger of moving as the Coyotes are the ones without an arena to play in at seasons end next year.. Even if a new arena is ever worked out somewhere in the valley, it would take at least 3 years before it is built and ready to host a hockey team? However, if both Seattle and Quebec City are used as relocation sites (assuming that ARZ and CAR actually are in trouble), it still leaves us with a 31 team league, likely an empty spot in the Central division. Kansas City? Houston?
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Post by donwood on Jun 5, 2016 14:57:21 GMT -6
Maybe sooner then later..... Inside source or pure speculation? I mean all that's going on right now does eerily resemble what happened with the whole PHX/WPG/ATL situation. Now it seems we have a situation with CAR/QUE/ARZ. With everybody assuming it is the Hurricanes to Quebec, I wouldn't be surprised that it is Phoenix on the move to Quebec, Hurricanes eventually shipped to Seattle once the arena is sorted out. In my eyes, the Coyotes appear to be the ones in 'imminent' danger of moving as the Coyotes are the ones without an arena to play in at seasons end next year.. Even if a new arena is ever worked out somewhere in the valley, it would take at least 3 years before it is built and ready to host a hockey team? However, if both Seattle and Quebec City are used as relocation sites (assuming that ARZ and CAR actually are in trouble), it still leaves us with a 31 team league, likely an empty spot in the Central division. Kansas City? Houston? After previous umm predictions I don't want to use the word "source" I have made connections with a number of Quebec fans some with 2nd or 3rd hand knowledge. (and no I don't watch for planes) The contention is that despite the vehement denials and the calendar, Carolina is still in play for this year. Obviously time is very short (Didn't Bettman say June 1 was the latest during the Atlanta sale?) IF anything happens this year it will be immediately following the final. Everything I've heard points to Carolina and that the Las Vegas expansion announcement has been delayed to get the Carolina situation handled whether it is movement or Karmanos sucking it up for at least another year. Also I dislike Gary Lawless intently but I've heard from a few people that Lawless now says he wouldn't be surprised if there was movement in the next 2 weeks. Anyone listen to Hustler & Lawless? This was on Friday.
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